Sheer magic! The full detailed agenda
http://video.google.co.uk/videoplay?docid=-1131942400352901009&q=esoteric+agenda&total=59&start=0&num=10&so=0&type=search&plindex=2  

--Last edited by dh on 2008-03-17 23:32:21 --

I have just finished watching this, three minutes ago! It is the most amazing documentary I have seen in years! There is so much in there and it ends on such a positive note. It confirms all of what I have believed and all that I have dabbled in is mentioned. It has given me hope and set me firmly yet again on the path of self realization and inner growth.

Thanks Paul.

Been watching this over the last couple of days,it has the same feel as  Zeitgeist and covers more material.
Is it by the same people?

Certainly looks and sounds like it!  

Shame about the ignorant Yank comment about NWO capitalism being the same as socialism. So much ignorance in the USA about socialism, its origins and its essential message. Now, of course, even Britain has been swamped by this pernicious, Yankee poison ...

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greengorilla wrote : Shame about the ignorant Yank comment about NWO capitalism being the same as socialism. So much ignorance in the USA about socialism, its origins and its essential message. Now, of course, even Britain has been swamped by this pernicious, Yankee poison ...

Actually Rory. I personally think it is the same thing. Dubya is a socialist. Tony and Cherie are Socialists, as she claims. Hitler was a (National)Socialist. The Fabian wing are gradualists coming to fruition,Fascism was a forceful grab,Stalinism=Nazism, Maoism finds its appalling outcome in modern China with 60 million dead and rising.Leftism in this country is the most stringent opponent of our ideas. I've spent much time with Indymedia and with loads of articles hidden, because I'm a right wing conspiraloon. Well I'm not and like you come from a left green anarchist perspective but none of these promoting arseholes have got the point. I'm pretty much pissed off with them, which is why I tolerate LondonMick so much even though I sometimes dislike his language
I'd never call myself a socialist or communist or anarchist or green any more than a conservative, a fascist, a BNP. These are all defunct ideologies. We're being twisted and abused with increasing speed right now. Everything that's being promoted  now is absolute bullshit. It's happening with incredible speed and we need to sort our defensive measures .
That will be my main theme I'm pushing on the new post nineeleven forum should we get it going (well it at least exists unlike Tony Gosling's so far)  

--Last edited by dh on 2008-05-28 23:39:36 --

What? Dubya is a socialist? When, where, how? He's a Republican and a pr!ck. Tony and Cherie are Nu Labor. Nothing at all to do with socialism. Capitalism is basically divided into two types: one run in the interests of private enterprise = straight capitalism and the other run by the state = state capitalism. There used to be something in the UK in the 'fifties somewhere inbetween called the Mixed Economy (during the days of Keynesian economics).

Now we have a disguised form of Thatcherism under Nu Labor called 'neo-liberalism' which is what the IMF and the World Bank is forcing on all governments everywhere including the EU.

Hitler used the word 'socialist' to get support from the Left. That's all. In practice he supported private rather than state capitalism. I can understand your disenchantment with the Left and 47 varieties of 'socialism'.

I think the truest definition of socialism is that still held by the old Socialist Party of Great Britain (founded in 1904) which is a movement of the working-people to totally abolish the wages system and to replace it with a moneyless mode of production. But working people must now include the unwaged.

That change of production mode requires a planetary system though. You can't have a moneyless society in just one country. Cuba tried it in the 'seventies & it failed. So the problem is that if socialists are elected in some countries & not others then they have to wait for the rest to catch up before a planetary moneyless mode of production can be implemented. So what you invariably end up with is state capitalism as you had in the Soviet Union and the old Mao China.

China has replaced state capitalism with a horrendous, Victorian form of slave labour under the banner of 'free enterprise'. The old leaders did this to distract their people from thoughts of freedom and revolution. It's not working. There will be another big revolution in China sooner or later.

But this time it'll affect us all over the world. And as I have tried to explain elsewhere we are potentially ever so close to implementing moneyless production for need rather than greed. But this will require people to understand the difference between what we have now and what we must replace it with.

It will also require planetary cooperation. Either we cooperate or die together. What is to be?  

--Last edited by greengorilla on 2008-05-29 00:08:08 --

Er yes - the organisation like bees in a hive with all our assigned lifespans and duties. That's why the beehive is so plentiful in their symbolism. That's the kind of socialist society they're trying to achieve, even though their methods may achieve the die off of bees. Ironic isn't it?

It's because of posts like this that I tolerate you, Paul!!!

Nice to know we're mutually tolerant, LM. Love would be a better word

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Er yes - the organisation like bees in a hive with all our assigned lifespans and duties. That's why the beehive is so plentiful in their symbolism. That's the kind of socialist society they're trying to achieve, even though their methods may achieve the die off of bees. Ironic isn't it?

Huh? What or whom are you referring to? China? I don't think anything I've said is registering, Paul. What kind of socialist society? Who? If you mean China, I've just tried to explain that what China had under Mao was a form of capitalism run by the state. That has now been replaced with an uncontrolled, privatised form of Victorian 'free enterprise' capitalism with very little worker's rights. It's privatisation at its worst.

The switchover from state capitalism to the present free-for-all took place as a result of the unrest in Beijing in 1989 which culminated in the demonstrations and state violence in Tianenmen Square.

China is not a beehive. I have an English friend who works in China teaching English. She adores the Chinese students who are polite and eager to learn unlike some of the brutes our teachers have to deal with.

Quote :

London Mick wrote : I have just finished watching this, three minutes ago! It is the most amazing documentary I have seen in years! There is so much in there and it ends on such a positive note. It confirms all of what I have believed and all that I have dabbled in is mentioned. It has given me hope and set me firmly yet again on the path of self realization and inner growth. Thanks Paul.

Ditto! I sat up all night watching it. I like happy endings.

China is not a beehive and Fidel is not a ruthless bastard as the lying BBC would have you think:

Fidel sends message to Hospital No. 1 in Chengdu
http://www.granma.cu/ingles/2008/mayo/mier28/message.html

CHENGDU, China, May 27 (PL). — Cuban leader Fidel Castro sent a message today to Hospital No. 1 in Chengdu, in Sichuan province, to tell staff there that they could count on the island’s medical brigade for as long as necessary.



Doctor José Rodríguez, head of the brigade, transmitted that message during a meeting with the hospital’s director, Doctor Li Yuan Feng.

Fidel also assured the hospital authorities that Cuba has well-trained medical personnel, who are desirous of supporting their brothers and sisters in China in the Chengdu region if the Chinese government finds that useful.

Dr. Rodriguez, who is leading the group of 35 doctors and paramedics that arrived on May 23 in China, thanked Dr. Li for the warm welcome and attention given to the Cuban personnel.

The hospital where the Cuban internationalists are working is the largest in this province of 90 million inhabitants, and is considered to be among the 30 best in the country.

Rodríguez also expressed the brigade’s willingness to remain in China to help attend to victims of the recent earthquake for as long as necessary, and to work wherever and under whatever conditions to help the Chinese people.

Dr. Li thanked Cuba and its leadership for the aid provided during this difficult situation caused by the earthquake, and said he would pass on Fidel Castro’s message to top authorities. Dr. Li also commented on the excellent relations between the two countries and their strong historical ties, which have been expressed particularly during difficult times.

Dr. Li recalled that during his visit to the hospital last Saturday, Prime Minister Wen Jiabao spoke for all Chinese people in thanking Cuba, and especially charged Dr. Li with taking care of the brigade members.

Translated by Granma International
http://www.granma.cu/ingles/index.html  

--Last edited by greengorilla on 2008-05-30 00:33:49 --

Shit, man. Blessed communitarians offering each other brotherly love across the abyss. It's always seemed a little absurd to me that Cuba should host or at least tolerate Guantanamo Bay at its heel. That's entirely grotesque, given the seeming enmity. OK, Cuba losing soviet support turned to a self-sufficient agrarian primarily organic economy - I can appreciate that. But the rest is smoke and mirrors. I find no love for all these anti-US systems. They all seem entirely tied into the game - opposames and such. They're all false delusions of struggle. The struggle is a deliberate and ever ongoing duplicity. La lutta continua, yawn yawn yawn to the end of time (quite soon)

Matthew 4:8 – 10.
8.  Again, the devil taketh him up into an exceeding high mountain, and sheweth him all the kingdoms of the world, and the glory of them;
9.  And saith unto him, All these things will I give thee, if thou wilt fall down and worship me.
10.  Then saith Jesus unto him, Get thee hence, Satan: for it is written, Thou shalt worship the Lord thy God, and him only shalt thou serve.


The devil controls all of the political parties.

Who would think otherwise ?


Robert.  

--Last edited by RobYork on 2008-05-30 23:10:48 --

I often wondered why the bullyboys of America have allowed Cuba to exist all these years and certainly Guatanamo Bay is a mystery.

Much as I love what Fidel and Cuba have done it still seems odd that they are allowed to get away with it.

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Shit, man. Blessed communitarians offering each other brotherly love across the abyss.

Ok, Paul, you know better than all the rest of us. A curse on both houses and blame it all on some far fetched conspiracy called the Illuminati ("a code we use when we're talking to ourselves" ).  

Fact: the Cubans were brave enough to shake off the yoke of US Imperialism and stay independent, so far for 51 years. More than Britland has having first orchestrated two world wars to save her Empire* and having fallen into US hegemony as a result.

At least Cuba's republic grows bananas and is independent. Our sad little US rump state has to import its bananas.

Fact: Guantánamo Bay was handed to the US by a legal treaty which if the Fidelistas had broken it would have given the mighty USA the excuse they were looking for to invade the island. Why, even the mighty China respected the Hong Kong treaty until it ran out! No conspiracies here, other than the legal one the USA coerced the Cubans with.

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Guatanamo Bay is a mystery.

It's no mystery at all to anyone who cares to run a simple check.

"The United States assumed territorial control over Guantánamo Bay under the 1903 Cuban-American Treaty, which granted the United States a perpetual lease of the area without the Cuban Government reacting. The current Cuban government considers the U.S. presence in Guantánamo to be illegal, arguing that the Cuban-American Treaty violates Article 52 of the 1969 Vienna Convention on the Law of Treaties, which declares a treaty void if its conclusion has been procured by the threat or use of force in violation of international law. However, Article 4 of the same document states that Vienna Convention on the Law of Treaties shall not be retroactively applied to any treaties made before itself."

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Guantanamo_bay

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It's always seemed a little absurd to me that Cuba should host or at least tolerate Guantanamo Bay at its heel. That's entirely grotesque, given the seeming enmity.

Why don't you check your facts before screaming, "Conspiracy!"



Fact: The Cubans transformed their economy and are loved by the people of South America and the world for their generosity (see article above). Between Cuba, Venezuela, Bolivia and Mercosur Latin America will be transformed & will throw off the yoke of Yanqui imperialism (an example that the Brits have yet to consider copying).

Fact: In South America La Lucha que Continua is real & is happening unlike whatever you're up to behind your computer screen. Yawning, yes indeed.

As a leader of the 911 'Truth' Movement in the UK I hope you're proud of all your great achievements. You had better be now before the BNP take over.

* See Conjuring Hitler by Guido Giacomo Preparata (Pluto Press, 2005)

http://tinyurl.com/5cctzo  

--Last edited by greengorilla on 2008-06-01 00:23:17 --

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As a leader of the 911 'Truth' Movement in the UK I hope you're proud of all your great achievements. You had better be now before the BNP take over.

Is that really addressed to me? That's completely unreal.
If the BNP took over we would notice no difference whatsoever
The BNP is a controlled false opposition. Their policies are deliberately aimed at the poor indigenous white working class whose grievances are entirely valid in some sense. The BNP is contolled to the top of its leadership by military intelligence infiltration. Having the BNP in charge would be just the same as New Labour or the Tories. They'd still be following orders. They'd be pro-EU in short shrift, love the codex alimentarius,embrace Zionism, do everything they were meant to do to create a fascist superstate, as is the given order
Or a communist one. Dont you hate those BNP communists?  

--Last edited by dh on 2008-06-01 00:43:19 --

Yes it is, Paul. I find your comments quite incredible. It's clear to me that you are ruled by prejudice and irrationality over some of the issues you have discussed here during my short time on this Forum.

Despite Tony Gosling's totally intolerant attitude towards my pro-Europe views I was always aware that on many other issues he and I had very similar views. Sadly he would never respond to the emails I sent him trying to reconcile our positions and, at least, simply agreeing to disagree on the main bone of contention.

But I have to be honest and say that you have some really weird views. Many of them are uninformed. For example your comments on Guantánamo Bay which were clearly uninformed and coming from a place of prejudice. Similarly your insistence that Neil Hague was doing a brilliant job with his Tarot cards, despite the fact that I was easily able to expose the way in which he misused and misrepresented a major symbol, the Twelve Stars.

The art-work, by the way, was really crude and is unlikely to get any serious interest from backers of art or finance.

When I wrote a long essay on the need for national healing, you and everyone else in fact just ignored it!

See http://westyorkshiretruth.aceboard.com/forum2.php?rub=9597&cat=4528&login=225988&page=3#id65291

Which leads me to the conclusion that readers on this Forum are just not interested in such issues. And yet, these are the major issues which face our society today. Do none of you care about what is happening to the societies in which we live?

It seems people would rather whinge about "the EU police state" as you do without any interest in actually attempting to analyse just where the British police state came from. That's what I mean about living in a state of denial. That includes the whingers. Nobody is interested to use their intelligence to make any analyses and when someone tries to do that they get ignored.

And by analysis I don't mean just sticking up a cut & paste job but arguing the issue in our own words. Not blame it all on someone else, never accepting  personal or collective responsibility.

That's so common in these columns. Either that or it's got to be a conspiracy. And talking about conspiracies it seems it's perfectly legitimate to refer to non-existent groups like the Illuminati because it's a sort of code or shorthand "when we're speaking with ourselves."

So is this what this Forum is? A place for the converted to preach to the converted? An opportunity to massage each other's egos & to tell each other how clever & brilliant we are? Never mind that the rest of the country remains unconverted and ignorant, we the knowledgeable elite know!

And it's ironic that whereas on occasion writers appear to deconstruct and analyse 911 and 77 most painstakingly (mostly off-forum writers) when it comes to a similar analysis of the favourite topics that we whinge about (some of which are mentioned above) any old prejudice will do in place of a reasoned discussion!

Frankly, I despair of this supposed Truth Movement both on this forum & elsewhere. What I have discovered is that the last thing it really is about is truth, It's about carefully selected, politically correct 'truth'.

It's a waste of time trying to discuss issues with folk who are coming from a place of prejudice. And your comments about the BNP are disgraceful! The BNP has promised to deport immigrants as Hitler did. Do you think they will not carry out their threats if elected into power? The BNP is not only racist it thrives on social unrest and prejudice. Do you seriously think that if such a party got into power that it would not change anything?

The BNP calls itself a "national" party. If it were honest with itself and us it would replace 'national' with "nazi". The popularity of the BNP is an alarming sign of the lurch to the extreme right in northern English cities in particular. Your excuses for the BNP and a lack to take them seriously shows me where you are coming from. That's why I say (clearly sarcastically) that you should be proud of your 'achievements.'

Before we ask ourselves how on earth this country has got into the mess it has we should ask ourselves how much our own attitudes and refusal to act has contributed to it. Just to keep blaming others is not only to evade responsibility, it is to run away from things.  

--Last edited by greengorilla on 2008-06-01 13:22:43 --

So now it's Pauls turn to be attacked!

Look pal, quite simply, we are way ahead of you. You are not in our league. You have so much more to learn. You are articulate and put together words nicely but you really are in the dark, like most people. You haven't a clue what is behind all the goings on in our world. You regurgitate the same old lefty claptrap that has changed nothing for the past century or so. Some of us have moved on. We are not fooled by the BNP. We see it for what it is. Go nad join Billy Bragg on one of his silly Anti-Racist gigs or check out when the next CND march to Aldermaston is on.
  You've come here, found fault with us all and condemned us all as racists and weirdoes and conspiracy nutters. We get that all the time from the sheeple. We don't need it here.

(By the way, have you actually ever watched the video at the top of the thread? probably not.)

Please feel free to come back to the forum when you are ready.

Now go away!

All the political parties are racist and thrive on social unrest and prejudice!

Divide and conquer is the oldest modus operandi in the book. Don't you think after a succession of Tory/Labour governments for the past century, that at least once, one of these administrations would have implemented a system that works, where there is peace and plenty, jobs and security, homes, healthcare and adequate education?

It's not meant to work! Nothing is by accident but by design.

They are poisoning us with aspartame, fluoride and arsenic in the water, chemtrails (barium, polymer fibres and aluminium) in the air and D.U... and now deliberate STARVATION! What part of killing four billion people do you not understand?

In defence of dh, (not that he needs it) in light of this uneccessary and scathing attack,  he is quite simply the best web-sleuth I have ever know (for many years) and an invaluable source of accurate information. Far better informed than me on certain issues.